Just a couple of notes:
" I think we have most of the top 20 customers on the foundry side running test chips with us. "
Very good news and I have heard this as well. I do not agree with "most" but certainly more than half. Lot's of test chips.
"And then secondly, yes, we missed the EUV thing, and that set us back. But largely, this is a good -- really good team, the TD team. So once we got readjusted to fixing that, their ability to execute is actually quite, quite good. Yes, as you mentioned, Intel 4 is now out with Meteor Lake, and that's already ramping and shipping. So we're -- we can check the box really on that one. And Sierra Forest will qual by the end of the first half of this year. So -- and that's the first Intel 3 products that pretty much check the box on that one."
Let's not check that box until Intel 3 products are ramping and shipping, not just "qualified".
"So what we have left is 20A and 18A, which are kind of like cousin nodes, I call it."
Or you can call it a half node like the rest of us do.
"We probably won't win anybody's major volume in 18A. We'll win some smaller SKUs, and that's all we need, to be honest with you."
Agreed. And if successful, Intel 14A will be the real proof in the foundry pudding. .
"Backside power, which we call PowerVia, both of those will be part of the 18A solution, which really makes it, I think, a really compelling offering."
When will Intel ship a PowerVia based chip? (Clearwater Forest?) And when will an IFS customer tape-out a PowerVia based chip? The billion dollar question.
"I mean Gina Raimondo was at your Direct Connect event, was very positive on the government's relationship with Intel and the sort of focus that they have."
She was on Zoom......
Q&A
Questions about the TSMC relationship:
A But we're a partner of theirs (TSMC). We are a customer of theirs. We actually sell stuff to them from our IMS business, our mask writing business. So it's a great relationship. I know Pat and C.C. meet on a regular basis. They have a great relationship. So I'm not particularly worried about it."
Constantly reminding the world that China is a danger to Taiwan and the semiconductor supply chain does not make for a good relationship with anyone from Taiwan much less the CEO of TSMC.
Q How quickly can you ramp up in the foundry services your trailing edge or non-bleeding edge business to sort of start getting cash flow from these unutilized facilities?
A Yes. I mean we -- so Intel 16, we do have customers on -- a customer on that. We also have a customer -- maybe multiple customers on Intel 3. So we are doing that. It does take time, too. It is like a year or two, in some cases, to ramp those customers. It also takes a little bit of time because those particular processes weren't developed to be foundry processes, whereas 18A, I think we really came at it with that mindset. So we have to do a little bit of like lifting with customers that takes a little bit longer.
A So it's -- onboarding a customer takes a bit of time, which kind of slows down the process. But it's absolutely part of the approach. We also -- in order to kind of accelerate it a little bit further, we've also partnered with certain legacy foundry customers to help accelerate it. We did that with Tower. We're doing that also with UMC. And those opportunities also, I think, we can move more quickly in terms of generating revenue and cash flow to help drive a better financial profile and obviously be able to invest in the leading edge.
I thought Intel 3 was a foundry focused process, good to know. Good excuse not to have foundry customers too.
" I think we have most of the top 20 customers on the foundry side running test chips with us. "
Very good news and I have heard this as well. I do not agree with "most" but certainly more than half. Lot's of test chips.
"And then secondly, yes, we missed the EUV thing, and that set us back. But largely, this is a good -- really good team, the TD team. So once we got readjusted to fixing that, their ability to execute is actually quite, quite good. Yes, as you mentioned, Intel 4 is now out with Meteor Lake, and that's already ramping and shipping. So we're -- we can check the box really on that one. And Sierra Forest will qual by the end of the first half of this year. So -- and that's the first Intel 3 products that pretty much check the box on that one."
Let's not check that box until Intel 3 products are ramping and shipping, not just "qualified".
"So what we have left is 20A and 18A, which are kind of like cousin nodes, I call it."
Or you can call it a half node like the rest of us do.
"We probably won't win anybody's major volume in 18A. We'll win some smaller SKUs, and that's all we need, to be honest with you."
Agreed. And if successful, Intel 14A will be the real proof in the foundry pudding. .
"Backside power, which we call PowerVia, both of those will be part of the 18A solution, which really makes it, I think, a really compelling offering."
When will Intel ship a PowerVia based chip? (Clearwater Forest?) And when will an IFS customer tape-out a PowerVia based chip? The billion dollar question.
"I mean Gina Raimondo was at your Direct Connect event, was very positive on the government's relationship with Intel and the sort of focus that they have."
She was on Zoom......
Q&A
Questions about the TSMC relationship:
A But we're a partner of theirs (TSMC). We are a customer of theirs. We actually sell stuff to them from our IMS business, our mask writing business. So it's a great relationship. I know Pat and C.C. meet on a regular basis. They have a great relationship. So I'm not particularly worried about it."
Constantly reminding the world that China is a danger to Taiwan and the semiconductor supply chain does not make for a good relationship with anyone from Taiwan much less the CEO of TSMC.
Q How quickly can you ramp up in the foundry services your trailing edge or non-bleeding edge business to sort of start getting cash flow from these unutilized facilities?
A Yes. I mean we -- so Intel 16, we do have customers on -- a customer on that. We also have a customer -- maybe multiple customers on Intel 3. So we are doing that. It does take time, too. It is like a year or two, in some cases, to ramp those customers. It also takes a little bit of time because those particular processes weren't developed to be foundry processes, whereas 18A, I think we really came at it with that mindset. So we have to do a little bit of like lifting with customers that takes a little bit longer.
A So it's -- onboarding a customer takes a bit of time, which kind of slows down the process. But it's absolutely part of the approach. We also -- in order to kind of accelerate it a little bit further, we've also partnered with certain legacy foundry customers to help accelerate it. We did that with Tower. We're doing that also with UMC. And those opportunities also, I think, we can move more quickly in terms of generating revenue and cash flow to help drive a better financial profile and obviously be able to invest in the leading edge.
I thought Intel 3 was a foundry focused process, good to know. Good excuse not to have foundry customers too.