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Yang Guanglei, former director of R&D at TSMC: Intel’s foundry industry has a 1% chance of success

Daniel Nenni

Admin
Staff member
Yang Guanglei, former director of R&D at TSMC: Intel’s foundry industry has a 1% chance of success

Yang Guanglei, an adjunct professor at National Taiwan University who once served as director of TSMC's R&D department and later became a senior technical advisor to Intel, said that there are inherent problems with Intel's development of wafer foundry business. Therefore, it was originally believed that Intel's foundry business had a 50% chance of success. After later going to the United States to discuss and communicate with Intel, the chance of success was reduced to 1%.

After Yang Guanglei gave a speech at SEMICON Taiwan, he was interviewed by the media and expressed his views on Intel's development of foundry business. He said that the current competition between TSMC and Intel is not the issue of not being advanced in process technology, because Intel's process. The technology is actually quite good, but due to its inherent problems, even if it develops advanced process technology and has a good yield rate, there will be no customers to use it, making it difficult to succeed in developing wafer foundry business.

Yang Guanglei believes that the first essential problem with Intel is that it does not have a customer-centric engineering mindset. He gave the example of TSMC. When Qualcomm, a major mobile processor manufacturer, was developing the first generation of processors, Yang Guanglei himself flew NB to San Diego, where Qualcomm's US headquarters is located, and stayed there for a week to communicate with Qualcomm. Later, they later switched to wafers produced by TSMC at 65nm. On the other hand, Intel is technology-oriented and does not have the mindset of serving customers. It is up to you whether customers want to use it or not. Therefore, the things developed are difficult to use and customers will not be willing to use them.

In addition, Yang Guanglei believes that the difficulty for Intel to develop wafer foundry now lies in the environment. He pointed out that the current employment focus of young people in the United States is in software, and they hope to work at Microsoft, Google, and META. There are almost no advanced semiconductor R&D and manufacturing talents. For the United States, the semiconductor industry is an immigrant enterprise. In the 1980s and 1990s, the American semiconductor industry was supported by Indians and Taiwanese with oriental faces. Now, after these oriental-faced talents will go to their original countries, it has become quite difficult for the U.S. semiconductor industry to continue to develop at this stage.

As for the US government's launch of the Science and Chip Act, which will provide US$53 billion in funds to encourage companies to invest in the United States to develop the semiconductor industry, Intel will also benefit. Yang Guanglei is not optimistic that this will succeed. The reason is that US$53 billion in funds is not as much as TSMC's annual revenue, and such subsidies must be allocated to each investing semiconductor company, so the amount is even smaller. There is really nothing that can be done with such funds. What's more, if the subsidy is provided this year, will it continue next year? This makes it very difficult to develop an industry relying on such "tonics" to have a chance of success.

 
I wonder how he defines “success”? Is it profitability, 50% GMs, being number 2, having more than 50% of intel’s wafer starts be external, IFS having the scale to prop up the IDM business on it’s own, some other thing? His point on customer centricnes also seems like a transient issue. TSMC didn’t pop out the womb as good as they are today. I wonder if he was of the impression that intel could never develop these muscles, if it was unlikely, or if the comment was more-so if intel carried on as it was when he formed this impression that the odds of “success” were low?
 
Agreed. His opinions seem to be unfounded. Here is another article from the event:

 
Well, if the technology is good enough, and Intel willing to provide a lower price than TSMC, I failed to see how they will fail in this industry.

Not being customer-centric, this reminds me of Google. GCP also being criticized of not being customer-centric, but they still have good cloud platform, tools and software, yet they have 10% of market share in cloud computing industry, where the top three only takes 60%~70% of market share. And they are still expected to grow under AI era. Let's recall, Google have a bad reputation that they always cancelling services, for those that don't know Google's track record, please visit https://killedbygoogle.com/

So If Google can takes 10% of market share where the top three only takes 60 ~ 70%. I bet Intel can take at least 20% of market share in a market where TSMC dominates ~90% for sub-5nm.
 
Well, if the technology is good enough, and Intel willing to provide a lower price than TSMC, I failed to see how they will fail in this industry.

Not being customer-centric, this reminds me of Google. GCP also being criticized of not being customer-centric, but they still have good cloud platform, tools and software, yet they have 10% of market share in cloud computing industry, where the top three only takes 60%~70% of market share. And they are still expected to grow under AI era. Let's recall, Google have a bad reputation that they always cancelling services, for those that don't know Google's track record, please visit https://killedbygoogle.com/

So If Google can takes 10% of market share where the top three only takes 60 ~ 70%. I bet Intel can take at least 20% of market share in a market where TSMC dominates ~90% for sub-5nm.
long ago, i read a blog about search engine and why Microsoft still invest in search engine even tho Google has the majority of the market share. it said even at 2 or 3% of the market share. it's enough revenue for Microsoft to keep going. it seems like the thesis is correct. DuckDuckGo is growing even tho it has less market share than all the big companies. i don't know how much market share Intel needs since Intel has a lot more headcounts.
 
long ago, i read a blog about search engine and why Microsoft still invest in search engine even tho Google has the majority of the market share. it said even at 2 or 3% of the market share. it's enough revenue for Microsoft to keep going. it seems like the thesis is correct. DuckDuckGo is growing even tho it has less market share than all the big companies. i don't know how much market share Intel needs since Intel has a lot more headcounts.

The "NOT TSMC" market is what Samsung has been living on the last few years, companies that do not want all of their products at one foundry (better pricing). Qualcomm and Nvidia are two of the biggest NOT TSMC customers. 14nm was the last time Samsung had a competitive process with TSMC, they were even able to split the Apple iPhone 6+ business. Since then Samsung is getting just the NOT TSMC business in my opinion.

Intel can win the NOT TSMC business away from Samsung and from what I have heard they already are. Intel 18A may beat TSMC on performance so that will be a competitive win and also a bit of NOT TSMC business maybe.

In my opinion Samsung is the real loser with Intel entering the leading edge foundry business. TSMC needs a leading edge competitor to innovate at a higher level and that is Intel, absolutely.
 
After he left SMIC' board of directors in 2021, he was hired by Intel as a consultant. That's why he is know what's going on in Intel. He just left Intel in the end of July.
His college friend revealed that Mr. Yang also told him that SMIC was capable of making 7nm 3 years ago. (Mr. Yang told his friend 3 years ago.)

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After he left SMIC' board of directors in 2021, he was hired by Intel as a consultant. That's why he is know what's going on in Intel. He just left Intel in the end of July.
His college friend revealed that Mr. Yang also told him that SMIC was capable of making 7nm 3 years ago. (Mr. Yang told his friend 3 years ago.)

View attachment 1433
Perhaps things have changed, but that blue badge designates an employee, not a consultant.
 
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